Public comment: No AI-powered surveillance in Eugene

The Eugene Police Commission heard public comment July 10 from 22 speakers who questioned the city’s growing use of surveillance. They suggested that EPD is violating city, county, and state sanctuary statutes and ordinances, and they criticized the Human Rights Commission for its silence on the issue.

Annie: My name is Annie, and I wanted to speak about the Flock cameras that are being installed around the city. They’re being labeled as license plate readers, but they’re much more than that.

[00:00:25] They are AI-powered surveillance cameras that are powered by AI, and that seems to be conveniently missed by everyone at the table. They have been used to identify faces, some of which were just trying to seek medical care.

[00:00:39] I am disgusted by the secrecy of this decision. These cameras have already been installed, and I am just now hearing about it.

[00:00:47] I’ve been in media work since I was a teenager. I’m 27 now. I’ve been to college to study these kinds of things, to study photography and video work. I’m aware that on a public street, if you can see it, you can shoot it. But just because it’s legal, doesn’t mean it’s always okay.

[00:01:01] Installing these cameras on the streets is a blatant violation of privacy for a lot of people in our community. And if photographers can understand the ethics of photographing someone in public without their consent to use for whatever they deem fit, then so should our officials.

[00:01:16] I want to reiterate to the taxpayers that many of our officials are keeping this as quiet as they can, calling these cameras ‘license plate readers,’ because they know that you’ll be upset about the details that these cameras can do. They know it’s wrong and they’re going to do it anyway. Surveillance of this magnitude has been done in other states, it’s been done in other countries, and it has always led to mishandling.

[00:01:39] This power of mass surveillance in our city will be abused. It will be used to target immigrants, minorities, women seeking medical care, and the working class. And it will be done using your tax dollars that you work your asses off for.

[00:01:52] Presenter: Sarah Jones:

[00:01:53] Sarah Jones: First, I’d like to respond to some of the pro-Flock comments over here (motioning to the police commissioners). Not all of us carry a smart phone around with us 24/7, especially in a day and age when we have a federal administration that so clearly chooses to disregard protected First Amendment speech on a regular basis, especially when it comes to Palestine advocates and the like.

[00:02:14] Second of all, Facebook and Instagram and Google don’t automatically send your location data to police departments. If they did, a lot less people would be carrying them around with them.

[00:02:24] Third of all, a smartphone is a type of surveillance that you can opt out of and consent to. This is a type of surveillance that can neither be opted out of nor consented to. So with that, I’d like to continue. I represent local residents who are appalled at EPD’s willingness to give up our privacy and data to the private company Flock. The department has done this without our consent or proper notification.

[00:02:47] I have a friend who lives right next to a camera that recently went up. It’s unmarked and no one in their neighborhood was informed of what it was or what data it captures before it was installed.

So in a perfect world, this expansion of mass surveillance would entail responsible and privacy-respecting use of its data, only accessible by subpoena. In a perfect world. We are not in a perfect world. What has actually happened is that these Flock cameras have allowed the use of personal data for illegal and unauthorized purposes.

[00:03:16] For example, when a Texas police department searched data from 83,000 Flock cameras, including those outside of their own jurisdiction, to track down a woman suspected of getting an abortion. They use data from Flock cameras in states where abortion access is protected by law…

[00:03:31] In 2023, a month’s long Electronic Frontier Foundation investigation involving hundreds of public records requests found that California police departments were sharing records containing detailed driving profiles of local residents without state agencies despite state laws explicitly prohibiting this.

[00:03:48] This means that even in so-called safe states, your data might end up helping law enforcement in Texas or Idaho prosecute you or your doctor. Because we know there’s been irresponsible privacy-breaching misuse of this technology to illegally track and harm individuals, we have to operate under the assumption that this misuse will continue.

[00:04:06] We cannot trust Flock, the private company, to handle our data in a way that’s consistent with our state and local laws, including our sanctuary laws. How this technology could be ethically used in theory is not the same as how it is actually being used by bad actors in our own government currently.

[00:04:21] The marginal benefit to public safety that it may provide is not worth the devastating damage it is already doing to our own jurisdictional sovereignty and our basic expectations of privacy.

[00:04:32] Presenter: Athena:

[00:04:33] Athena: So basically, what I think needs to happen is that you guys need to have the power to make policy actually, and not just be making a recommendation. That’s kind of how I see this.

[00:04:41] And you know, to me, it’s like, what if the city council gave the city manager a recommendation, and then the city manager made all the laws? I don’t know, it’s kind of weird. That’s kind of how I see this.

[00:04:51] I see these people are the volunteers that are appointed by City Council and they’re more like the public and like hearing from the public directly, like this. So that to me makes it more like that’s the decision-making—but not really. It gives recommendations…

[00:05:06] I don’t have a whole lot else to say but I did want to touch on the fact that we pay your guys’ salaries. And I know that you guys want to keep people not fearing police officers. These Flock cameras are not a good way to do that.

[00:05:23] They’re just not. You’re going to scare the crap out of everybody around and they’re not going to want anything to do with police, like ever again. So if you’re really worried about making people not fearing police, not fear police, then maybe working with a privatized company like Flock is not a good idea. Thank you.

[00:05:43] Presenter: Pete Goldlust:

[00:05:44] Pete Goldlust: So I want to say to piggyback on that last comment about creating trust. I’m a father and educator, a small business owner in Eugene. I’m not comfortable coming here for this meeting. It really is an obstacle. I can imagine how many people are not here tonight because This is not the place for this meeting to happen. It is a strong arm tactic. It’s not right.

[00:06:16] Back to the cameras. This is not the time for this community to invest in new gizmos to surveil us and to implement new systems to seamlessly communicate with police in Alabama and Texas and Mississippi. I know there’s supposedly guardrails in place, not there. There’s all kinds of ways for these to slip through.

[00:06:47] It’s like we’ve created, we’ve put in place a system that makes this communication seamless and then depending on guardrails to stop that communication from taking place. I mean, it beggars the imagination to think that those guardrails can hold.

[00:07:08] Again, your question, Commissioner (Jack) Radey, about: ‘What’s the principle?’ The principle is exactly that, that we have a choice to carry a smartphone to give our information away to private companies as we see fit or not. This is the government. I don’t have that choice.

[00:07:30] And it’s not just collecting the license number of the person that’s speeding through and causing a safety issue. It’s everybody else is having their information taken. That cop that’s sitting there on the side of the road may be looking, but they are noting every single one, they are noting every single license plate through this AI camera, and it is not just a license plate after it is an AI camera.

[00:08:01] There are all kinds of ways for this information to get loose and of course it will. All this information always gets loose. Nobody can give us reassurances that this information is safe. Certainly not a product company.

[00:08:14] Bailey Gilmore: Hello. My name is Bailey Gilmore.

[00:08:17] Community initiated testimony is distinct from engagement and public hearings in advance of the implementing a sweeping mass surveillance scheme until the already installed cameras were reported in the news, not even the police commission knew they were being considered.

[00:08:31] And in fact, EPD intentionally withheld that information in a strategic move to get momentum on the side of surveillance project, despite securing funds for the project in July of 2024 and applying for them prior to that.

[00:08:45] No effort to convene stakeholders was made nor has been made. No public hearing was held and no community input was solicited even after the contract was signed and surveillance began. Surveiling the total population of Eugene without our knowledge, let alone consent, is an extraordinary act. Certainly, it demonstrates that EPD is uninterested in building trust between the community and the police.

[00:09:10] When this topic came up at the last commission meeting, it was unclear who was in the know, but I felt educated about the purpose of this commission by a response, which was hardly any complaint about being intentionally kept in the dark about an extraordinarily sweeping surveillance tool that affects everyone in Eugene— lifelong residents, and visitors alike.

[00:09:30] And as far as I know, since learning of the system, you have not taken any action to engage the public on this mass surveillance scheme, nor to even inform the public.

[00:09:38] I have done extensive research on this surveillance system, and I feel eager to meet with commissioners to provide additional important information. For now, I’ll share a few key points.

[00:09:48] One: Federal agencies can make and have made subpoenas to private companies that those companies are not allowed to disclose.

[00:09:55] Two: In March, ICE added 7,000 people to the NCIC hot list for deportation orders. The system also allows users to write anything in the justification field. It is easy to make it unclear to EBV, that a data request is tied to an immigration enforcement.

[00:10:14] Three, Commissioner Radey, I’d like to respond. License plates are to prove that the car is licensed to operate on the road. That’s what a license plate is for. And so this vast surveillance system violates the right to privacy. The data has been misused and shared without oversight. False matches lead to dangerous mistakes. And it should be rejected by our community. Thank you.

[00:10:38] Anna Lardner: Hi, everybody. My name’s Anna. I’m an organizer of the Trans Alliance of Lane County. I’m also with Pride and the Rainbow Guard, I’m going to address these comments specifically to Capt. Burke because I sat next to you at a Human Rights Commission panel in December (12/14). And we shared that table and talked about how EPD was going to be building a culture of community collaboration and how we were going to work with other members of the marginalized communities that have been historically excluded from EPD processes.

[00:11:08] I came away from that, tentatively, very happy with where things might go. And I was horrified to see that EPD had implemented an Orwellian panopticon in the age of Donald Trump, in 2025 America, without any consultation with the people that you sat next to and told me that you wanted to consult. And that’s really upsetting to me. I think we as a city deserve better.

[00:11:34] From a policy standpoint, this policy is also egregious. Capt. Burke and Chief Skinner at the previous meeting continued to cite Amber Alerts, vehicular theft. They talk about murders. The policy doesn’t say that. The policy says this may be used for routine patrol investigations. It doesn’t say that you need probable cause. It doesn’t say you need reasonable suspicion.

[00:11:56] It includes a low evidentiary bar of nothing. If you’re on patrol, you can use this. To your comment, Mr. Radey, Commissioner Radey, about the police are not looking for you unless for some specified reason, I am a gender-affirming care provider. I am a trans woman. I write letters of gender-affirming care for young people. When this administration comes for me and gives a specific federal warrant to come for me, this system can be used to do that.

[00:12:25] We should not have this system here in Eugene. And at a very very minimum, this needs to be rolled back to the beginning to involve the community, so the community that you represent, and that you said you would draw on, can be at the table to make these decisions. Thank you.

[00:12:40] Presenter: Ryder Hales.

[00:12:41] Ryder Hales: Well, thank you for your time tonight and for your thoughtful discussion and thank you for tabling both items, hopefully as a way to ensure meaningful public input and to get as much as possible. Hopefully that’s the reason for the tabling.

[00:12:56] But the problem is that we as the community just don’t trust the police. We’re concerned about actions and not about like good sounding words and like thoughtful discourse within a commissioner’s meeting.

[00:13:08] I don’t have that much more to share than others. Many folks here can eloquently speak on the surveillance issues with Flock cameras, the fact that EPD despite its claims of upholding Sanctuary Promise Act is just continuing to be complicit in actions by ICE, other federal agencies. There’s not really much more I can say.

[00:13:34] We just don’t trust the police and we want to see actions and not words. We want to see the public be able to share their thoughts before our massive loads of taxpayer dollars are being used to fund Flock cameras.

[00:13:49] We want to see that the police are actively trying to protect our immigrant neighbors and actually standing up to ICE, not crowding around people demonstrating their right to assemble and certainly not devoting a massive load of vehicles to drive through a peaceful assembly at Wayne Morse Plaza just this past Tuesday, during a time when detentions weren’t actually even happening.

[00:14:12] I did not make either of those actions this past Tuesday or the Tuesday before, but I’m well aware that EPD’s response was unsurprisingly unsatisfactory amongst the many passionate people within this crowd.

[00:14:25] So once again, thank you for tabling, I presume to gather as much public input as possible and caring about us as a community. Let’s see it put into action with good policing that actually protects the people, which it doesn’t do right now.

[00:14:43] Jacob Griffin: Hey, my name is Jacob Griffin. I belong to Trans Alliance of Lane County. I’m a Jewish trans man living here in Eugene, and I can’t tell you how frightened I am of what I’ve heard tonight.

[00:14:59] Let me give you an example. First of all, we are in rising fascism. Is there anyone at this table who does not believe that—that our federal government is rising fascism and is not paying attention to the guardrails? You are our local guardrail and you are bending. Let me give you a glimpse into my thoughts on this.

[00:15:20] I, every day in order to maintain the body that keeps me alive, take testosterone, a Schedule III drug, I am required by the federal government to register as a user of that drug. All they have to do is match me up with this, should they intrude over the barriers of this private company that we have no control over, and they know who I am.

[00:15:50] And since the first day of this administration, they have made destroying trans people a goal. Locating trans people, putting cameras on the street so visibly trans people are apparent. And you’re on the Human Rights Commission.

[00:16:11] I am just appalled by this entire event. Not one of you spoke up and said this is a really bad idea in a time of fascism? My god, what are you doing? You’re going to get some of us killed.

[00:16:32] I watched people walk into the federal building this week not knowing if they would come out and like they were playing Russian roulette with people’s lives, not knowing if they’re going to take them to Tacoma and send them to Sudan.

[00:16:49] And you are adding to the information pile. I don’t care how f—ing much information they have. Don’t give them more. And I don’t care how honest EPD is. There is no part of our federal government that cares about them. Please don’t.

[00:17:09] Kai: My name is Kai. I’m a former 911 dispatcher. I’m pretty familiar with law enforcement searches and the databases that you got access to. I do not expect you to be a cybersecurity expert. I think that’s not in your purview. This company came to you and offered you cybersecurity experts to talk to.

[00:17:35] I have two requests for you. The first is please consult some independent cybersecurity experts. Do not take Flock Safety’s word for how things like storage of footage work. For example, you were told that you own the data and I’m not sure that it was properly explained to you what that means.

[00:17:57] They say the data is encrypted, but there are a lot of different kinds of encryption. And again, I don’t expect you to be intimately familiar with those, but find an independent person who is and please consult with them.

[00:18:09] My second ask is for an increase in transparency and it sounds like you are working on that. The Lexington Police Department publishes the location of all of their cameras. They publish statistics, they publish their audits. That might be a good place to start.

[00:18:27] You might also consider going back to the transparency page for EPD that is published on Flock’s website and re-list the agencies that you are sharing with. I understand that has changed recently. And that does sound like a positive change but now it’s really unclear to us who is actually being shared with.

[00:18:47] Please publish your CSV as others do. And perhaps show us what a search or alert looks like because I think we are imagining the worst. And a lot of people don’t understand what a database search looks like. Thank you.

[00:19:03] Presenter: Rob Sheldon:

[00:19:04] Rob Sheldon: So, yeah, I came here with a whole thing prepared and then over the course of the meeting, I heard some surprisingly insufficient consideration of Policy 1204 and Flock and now I’ve had to rewrite everything.

Two minutes is not enough time to cover everything that was stated that was technically wrong or wrong in principle.

[00:19:28] Flock, first off, is not just an ALPR system. So it is a powerful search engine for surveillance with lots of data sharing built right into it. It is disingenuous to write a general-purpose ALPR policy and then apply it to Flock. There really are two different things. Policy 1204 may be sufficient for some ALPR systems, but it is not sufficient for Flock.

[00:19:55] Regarding alerts, I think somebody else already made this point, but ICE added 7,000 persons to NCIC. We just learned for immigration related reasons. So those alerts would then be just by Flock on any of the devices that it offers. By the by, in terms of security and everything else, flock offers mobile apps. I would just like people to consider the reality of people walking around with the system on mobile devices and the security implications of that. Commissioner (Jack) Radey, regarding data collected, it’s not just license plates.

[00:20:33] I don’t have enough time here, but I suggest you contact us after the meeting so we can get you up to speed. Commissioner (Alan) Leiman, I can’t imagine you are unaware of national security letters, but there are any number of mechanisms by which the federal government can demand data from third parties like Flock.

[00:20:51] Regarding technical matters, you got bad advice from your county IT (and my time is up) but the lack of end-to-end encryption and the fact that EPD doesn’t own the encryption keys for this data means the system is not safe from access outside of your control.

[00:21:07] Presenter: Lynn:

[00:21:08] Lynn: I think that just fundamentally having 30 days worth of my locations is wrong for somebody to have. There’s devices that police use called Stingrays, right, and they track phones. They can ping and, you know, to say which phone is theirs, but the thing is, is that you need a warrant or a really good probable cause to use it, and that’s only like within a half-mile radius of where someone is.

[00:21:36] So if there needs to be a warrant to get my cell phone information right, then why is it okay to just store my license plate where I drove for the past 30 days?

[00:21:49] I think that you really just need to realize that everybody in this room can, they could plug in your license plate in the parking lot and they could just know everywhere that you went for the last 30 days.

[00:22:01] We have no law or no, like, there’s no accountability system intact to know, like, we’re being told that it’s not being used on a pinkie swear and a contract with, with what, a private company. I think that that’s just gross.

[00:22:18] I think that, you know, if there’s just so many ways that this could be abused. And I think that it’s naive to think that it’s not going to, at some point, be used for something maybe not intended.

[00:22:31] But, you know, it’s just, I really don’t like it. I think that the reality is, is that if EPD maybe got a picture of a man with a license plate, maybe that person had been arrested on, you know, some crime beforehand, but he was in a parking lot of a house with a couple of people. What’s to stop them from putting in the license plate of the people that he was with to track them? And it could just be a family member, right?

[00:22:59] Like a lot of us have, unfortunately, you know, family members that suffered from drug addiction and other things. So if they get, you know, if there’s a picture given with them and other vehicles, what’s to stop them from searching every other vehicle that’s in that picture? There’s no there’s no like stop you know.

[00:23:18] They right now they’re like they say that there’s a contract in place and there’s policy but at the same time like there’s no legal mechanism, right? Like, there’s no like real accountability or the need for, like, a judge to maybe look it over, you know. It’s just free: They can just plug it in and be done.

[00:23:36] Manuel: Hi everyone, my name is Manuel. I really didn’t like sitting through the first part. I’m sorry if I upset some of y’all. I think that you should all listen to what I think is a very well-informed public, certainly a lot more informed that your conversation was regarding this issue.

And that is appalling and shameful to me and I don’t know if it is to you, but I think that y’all have a duty to be informed about these type of decisions and it just doesn’t seem like there’s any due diligence in the transparency aspect.

[00:24:19] Unfortunately, I don’t seem to recognize any of y’all, and I’ve been living here in a while, and I serve folks here. I heard a bit about you, (HRC Commissioner) John (Bradley), and I’m really appalled that you’re not raising flags for this because you sit on the Human Rights Commission, right? I think that’s what I heard.

[00:24:39] I want to, yeah, just maybe use my time for you to take a moment to reflect about the reasons that you’re here. There’s any ulterior agendas, they’re not clear to me. This is not about public safety. Let me tell you that.

[00:24:54] There’s a lot of crises-breaking and there’s a lot of public safety issues-ignoring and there’s a lot of, yeah, different lack of resources and what I hear about it in my community is that EPD chases people for giving burritos out at the parks or, yeah, choose to harass folks that look like me.

[00:25:14] So don’t be surprised if I have comments in the meantime that you’re talking, because it’s just not, not an informed opinion or at least not one that reflects my values. Thank you.

[00:25:32] Naphtali Renshaw: My name is Naphtali. I am a faith leader that works with UMC. I’m saying that because I don’t actually recognize any faith leaders in the room right now. I work with and facilitate space for many different targeted communities, including members of various BIPOC communities and 2SLGBTQI+ communities in the area, and I’m on Eugene Pride Coordinating Committee and Rainbow Guard.

[00:26:06] What I know from my work is that we move at the speed of trust of the communities that we work with. And what I’m hearing today around the room, and what I know from the communities that I work with every single day and the relationships I’ve built is that we don’t have a lot of trust in this room right now.

[00:26:27] We’re making decisions regarding surveillance in a very dangerous time. And it’s not safe for a lot of the people in this room to be surveilled constantly.

[00:26:38] It’s also important to recognize, not only do we have immigrants who have lived in our community for many years, we have immigrants that are moving to our state and specifically Eugene because we have been heralded as a safe place as a sanctuary place and this is not sanctuary. When you have feared for your life literally from your family and you make it to a place that you think is safe and then you find out that you’re under a camera every time you drive that’s not safe.

[00:27:12] And if we are looking at being transparent community, then we need to work on that. And I guess part of that, that are encouraged the EPD to do in that pursuit is be honest when things do happen. Mistakes are made, there are nuances. What happens when the EPD does support ICE inadvertently? Are we honest about that?

[00:27:37] And when we write about that in the press, we don’t take back statements without actually being honest with the public that we’ve done that. Thank you.

[00:27:46] Kamryn Stringfield: My name is Kamryn Stringfield. I have she/her pronouns and I’m an organizer with the Party for Socialism and Liberation. A lot tonight has been said about Flock so I’m not going to be talking about that. I’m going to be talking about the demonstrations recently and directing this to our acting chief.

[00:28:01] These last two weeks, our community members have been mobilizing to oppose the unconstitutional and inhumane activity of ICE here in Eugene at the old federal building. We have been exercising our First Amendment rights to speak out against the injustices happening there, and there has been virtually zero violence. Nobody has been harmed by our demonstrations, but ICE has certainly been harming immigrants and their families.

[00:28:26] So why was EPD so present and seemingly involved with ICE during these last two demonstrations? We counted 12 drive-bys by EPD this last Tuesday. And last week we watched as EPD staged in the Lane County parking lot to the west of the federal building and did nothing as an ICE vehicle drove through people at the gate. We saw that vehicle go over to where EPD was immediately afterwards and talked with you. Then it went to transfer detainees.

[00:28:56] Then less than three hours after that demonstration, your department rushed out a statement with misinformation about that vehicle and seemed to discredit protesters. You later quietly edited to remove the misinformation, but the question remains, why did you spread that misinformation in the first place?

[00:29:14] Lastly, what are EPD’s policies on crowd control for ICE? And how does your surveillance and presence at these demonstrations relate to that? And while I have the time as well, thinking about the flock cameras, this is not the only part of our mass surveillance system here. There’s the drones, his first responders program. There’s the Guardian towers. There’s the stingray system. There’s all of these mechanisms already out there to surveil us. Why do we need another one?

[00:29:40] And why is there no public comment on it? This is shameful. And it makes us afraid in the city. I’m a trans woman. I share the same fears as others. Thank

[00:29:51] Dr. Geoffrey Gordon: My name is Dr. Geoffrey Gordon. I live and work as a clinical psychologist in the city of Eugene. Regarding the police presence on July 1, Acting Chief Burke said the employees of federal protective services work for Homeland Security and wear HSI identification. This is who the EPD established communication with regarding policing of the building while an immigration enforcement action was occurring in the building.

[00:30:13] DHS is included as an immigration enforcement agency per Oregon Revised Statute 180.805: ‘Federal immigration authority means the United States Department of Homeland Security, the United States Immigration and Customs Enforcement, the United States Citizenship and Immigration Services, the United States Customs and Border Protection or a successor agency any other federal immigration agency or official or any other entity to which a federal immigration agency delegates or assigns the authority to detect, investigate, or enforce violations of immigration law.’ So just to review, that includes DHS and ICE.

[00:30:49] Furthermore, on March 13, 2017, the Eugene City Council unanimously passed the Protection for Individuals ordinance, Council Ordnance No. 20579. ‘This ordinance provides certain protections for all Eugene residents, including immigrants. This action puts provisions of an existing state law into city code, preventing the use of city resources, to detect or apprehend individuals whose only violation of the law is that they are present in the United States in violation of federal immigration laws. While modeled after the state law, this Eugene city ordinance is not dependent on the state law existing.’

[00:31:25] That was a full quote. If the Eugene Police Department has communications with Homeland Security agents during an immigration enforcement action at the same building, thus assisting several apprehensions by ICE, then the relevant revised statues were violated and Council Ordinance No. 20579 was violated. Given these violations by the EPD, which betrayed the public trust, I’m asking if Police Chief Skinner is willing to offer his resignation and apology to the people of Eugene.

[00:31:52] Because he’s not present, I am asking the acting chief if he will pass on this question to Chief Skinner for his public response. Thank you.

[00:31:59] Presenter: Jetty Etty:

[00:32:00] Jetty Etty: Okay, so I was there on July 1 outside of the old federal building. I was standing right pretty close to where this car was driving out of the gates. It was clearly some sort of a government car. I’d like to know who that was, whether it was ICE, DHS, EPD, or somebody else.

[00:32:22] That car, when it came out, it was literally running somebody with a walker’s wheel over, and it kept going forward and people asked it to stop.

[00:32:33] Like, I don’t know how EPD is not speaking about this. We have police officers that were walking out of their car watching this saying, ‘Hey, let’s play nice now.’ I think that’s a shame and I want answers.

[00:32:46] Why did they worry about property, destruction or whatever, and not about human lives? That’s so weird to me.

[00:32:54] As a person who is constantly being targeted and ticketed and followed by EPD officers, I think the Flock cameras are disgusting. I think they’re terrifying. And I think there needs to be some sort of like, you guys are going to have them, you need to have monitors on them, like how are people not going to misuse these, like when the police officers that constantly follow me around for doing homeless outreach, can track my car wherever I’m at and continue to criminalize me, like, who’s going to hold them accountable, this is so crazy to me, like, y’all are out of control. (I’m done.)

[00:33:34] Bob Moland (PSL): My name is Bob Moland. I am also an organizer with the Party for Socialism and Liberation. Much has already been said about the Flock camera issue that I agree with, so I won’t get too far into that.

But I would like to push back on some of the flawed logic and a couple of the issues that have been discussed today, chiefly that the police exist to prevent crime when in reality, police forces respond to crime and detain potential suspects in addition to other things. But what actually prevents crime are well-funded social services and that ensure that the basic needs of people get met.

[00:34:19] And when it comes to the funding of the Flock cameras, it was said that this is going to be done through a grant, but as these things continue, whatever criminal activity is picked up on these cameras will simply be used as a need for future money in the budget that goes to EPD because they’ll detect a bunch of things and they’ll say, ‘Well, look at all the crime that’s now occurring that we need more money to prevent.’ So I would say that there’s kind of a flaw there as well.

[00:34:53] I would also just like to also strongly reject the surveillance of peaceful protests. I’ve been a part of many protests since January of this year, and at every single one there has been drone surveillance, there has been multiple EPD drive-bys, it really feels like the EPD does not have a neutral or even encouraging aspect to people demonstrating their free speech, but rather are there to observe and intimidate.

[00:35:27] Sean Townsend: My name is Sean Townsend. I’m the vice president of APWU (American Postal Workers Union) Local 679 here in Eugene. I want to make some comments on specifically the policy that is laid out inside of Resolution 5174 as well as Ordinance Number 20579, Subsection 2.497.

[00:35:48] I know you guys kind of touched on some of this, but I want I want to make an argument based on it.

[00:35:54] So one could argue that the Flock cameras violate Section G and Section H of Resolution 5174 ‘s findings. The way they’re being used is intimidating. The specific language that I would argue that is at task here: ‘We strongly condemn bias, intimidation, harassment and other acts that are based on age, faith, race, national origin, immigration status, gender identity, ability, ethnicity, housing status, or sexual orientation.’

[00:36:29] It violates a lot of those, plain and simple.

[00:36:33] Section H: ‘We are committed to ensuring that all members of our community are free from acts that are rooted in fear, ignorance, prejudice, and hate.’ I would argue that fear and prejudice are part of the formula here, if they’re misused, okay?

[00:36:52] The Flock cameras also might violate Ordinance 20579 Subsection 2.497, Information not to be collected or maintained. Subsection 1: ‘No city law enforcement personnel may collect or maintain information about the political, religious, or social views, associations, or activities of any individual, group, association, organization, corporation, business, or partnership unless such information directly relates to an investigation of criminal activities and therefore are reasonable grounds to suspect the subject of the information is or may be involved in criminal conduct.’

[00:37:30] You’re collecting information regardless of whether there’s an active investigation or not.

[00:37:36] Janet Whitlow: My name is Janet Whitlow and I am not as well researched on all of the what has been published that so many wonderful people have spoken about. So I’m coming at this new and so I apologize if I’m not addressing anything that you already addressed, but in addition to the things about the trans community and ICE and the data collection and the security, which I all agree with our previous people who spoke, I was wondering.

[00:38:11] Has it been addressed (or could it be addressed) if you did bring this for a future public comment, are you laying the infrastructure for something that would potentially restrict movement in the future with social credit stores or with carbon footprint that is outside of your current scope?

[00:38:27] What are you laying the foundations for here with the collection of data outside of the license plates, which this infrastructure can very easily collect. So if you do have future public comment, which a lot of people have requested, could you please address that in addition to all the other wonderful questions that have been asked?

[00:38:50] Brian: Hi, my name is Brian. I just wanted just to just simple quote you. Anybody can Google (even though we don’t want to really use Google right now because the oligarchs, people in charge, you know, the people, the owners of this country/the world/people that have all the money. Like, you know, the people who own Google are on the board. You can Google anything, right)? So it’s just a Benjamin Franklin quote. Quote: ‘Those who give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.’

[00:39:23] I mean, where the hell are we at right now? Look at the country. Look at Portland. They’re knocking people out and bringing them into the ICE facilities.

[00:39:33] You know, I came to this state from a different state, from a more diverse state. Well, you know had its own bad history, but I don’t see enough dark people. And it upsets me and I wish there was more dark people because I feel more comfortable around them and you, and are they going to come here anymore, if you guys deny them the ability to live free in a sanctuary city that we were promised to have?

I’m just so upset with the whole board, especially (Human Rights Commission liaison) John (Bradley). As mentioned before, look at your role and your job and what you should be doing.

[00:40:22] This is not cool. I have to go, I’ve been wanting to volunteer and I feel I would really need to volunteer at some of the 4J schools ’cause they need brown people to talk to the kids and and give them encouragement in life and they’re scared. They’re scared of their moms and their dads being kidnapped and maybe disappeared.

There’s people dying. Why are they dying in facilities? Alligator f—ing Auschwitz? Are you f—ing kidding me?

[00:40:52] Matthew: My name is Matthew. I’m coming to this also at a very late date. So I might be missing information. However, have you looked at the costs of these things, the installation, the maintenance, the monitoring, all of that stuff. And would that cost be better used in hiring extra police officers on the ground that can think for themselves and move things along.

[00:41:19] And also I would like to point out that this in America we think of ourselves as free, to think of this as a free country. But these are what we’re what we’re discussing here. This is the precursor to being able to monitor everyone everywhere all the time. It would be an easy upgrade to convert this to facial recognition, which could be tied to the RealID.

[00:41:47] And this is beginning to feel very like a Soviet communist state. All of these things that we think of are un-American, as far as monitoring, being able to monitor everywhere, everyone everywhere.

[00:42:04] And we are at a point where I believe we need to be very, very brave. Instead of being fearful and installing these things, I think we need to be brave enough to avoid installing these things and find other ways and other methods to address what is probably a very, very small percentage of the population of Eugene and Springfield in comparison to the amount of people who would be tracked constantly.

[00:42:35] So I think I would just like to add that so that you guys can put that into your decision-making process, please.

[00:42:43] Heather Gardner-Madras: This is Heather Gardner-Madras. I wasn’t going to speak, but I just wanted to collect several of the points that were made tonight and connect them together that stuck out to me.

[00:42:53] First of all, the transparency around the deployment of these cameras was atrocious. It does seem sneaky if you don’t tell anyone, including the Police Commission. And during this time in our history, it looks even worse. It’s a black mark against the EPD and trust broken.

[00:43:12] Secondly, several people have mentioned and have more technical knowledge than me, but I work in tech and I do understand that there are serious technical and data control vulnerabilities with this system, This private company that endangered the residents of Eugene and their privacy even if every member of EPD was flawless we could still be exposed harassed or worse.

[00:43:38] An independent assessment sounds like a fine idea to me. It should have been done before it was deployed and I feel like they should be taken down until all of these issues are addressed and you know, the process is made more transparent, the vulnerabilities are addressed.

[00:43:55] And it was news to me, I mean, I did know about some of the surveillance systems, but the listing of surveillance systems, I feel like EPD should have to make an argument as to why they need this additional tool to keep us safe, and what the benefit would be to us, the citizens, again, before deployment.

[00:44:16] And most importantly, we currently are being taken over by a fascist regime at the federal level, people in the state are terrified, people in the city are terrified, whether they’re a citizen, an immigrant, one of a marginalized community, or, you know, a white cis person like myself.

[00:44:34] So, you know, I think that needs to be taken into account what period of time we’re in. And also, to the commissioner that basically said ‘If you didn’t do anything wrong, what are you worried about?’: You’re either grossly naive or disingenuous and that’s—I find that really insulting, honestly.   

[00:44:52] Presenter: During public comment at the Police Commission July 10, 22 speakers questioned whether the Flock system is actually making Eugene safer. They say it’s making the city more dangerous today for immigrants and trans folks, and making it more dangerous tomorrow for everyone else.